r/HistoricalWhatIf

What if Germany had ignored, or focused much less, on taking Stalingrad in WW2?

In the original Fall Bleu (Case Blue) plan by Germany, the strike into the southern oilfields and territories of Russia, taking Stalingrad wasn’t necessary, but it was focused on regardless during the execution of the plan. What if Germany actually followed the plan and didn’t focus so much on Stalingrad, avoiding the 300,000 man encirclement, including plenty of equipment, and the failure of Case Blue, that ended the chance of Germany winning in Russia? How would the rest of the war turn out, and the Eastern Front, with a successful Case Blue and no devastating encirclement?

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u/CauliflowerFlaky9903 — 5 hours ago

What if Arianism became the dominant form of Christianity?

Arianism, named after its founder Arius, was an early form of Christianity which teaches that Jesus was a created being and not equal with the Father, and therefore denies the doctrine of the Trinity. It was popular in the first few centuries AD before being condemned as heretical. The only Christian denominations that follow such teachings today are the Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses.

But what if Arianism became the universal view of Jesus's relationship with the Father? How might Christianity have developed differently?

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u/TheRedBiker — 10 hours ago
▲ 1 r/HistoricalWhatIf+1 crossposts

What If Disney Always had the Theme Park Rights to Marvel?

Seriously, what if instead Universal, it was Disney that secured the theme park rights to Marvel in the early 2000's. How would the park be different?

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u/Carnage678 — 1 day ago

What if Germany used the ground forces to close the Dunkirk pocket instead of trying to bomb them out in WW2?

In 1940, during the German invasion of France, hundreds of thousand of troops were stuck in the Dunkirk pocket. German panzer divisions were told to halt and let the Luftwaffe planes bomb the troops. The German air force didn’t succeed, allowing hundreds of thousand of extra British and French forces, including nearly the entirety of the British Expeditionary Force. What if the order to halt ground troops hadn’t been given? Would the hundreds of thousand British POWs push Britain to surrender? What would it mean for the rest of the war, like the invasion of the USSR, now with a more powerful Air Force, not hurt by the Battle of Britain, and not distracted by other theaters? Would Germany be able to open a Caucuses front by pressuring a surrounded Turkey to join the Axis? How would the war turn out?

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u/CauliflowerFlaky9903 — 2 days ago

Is it possible that the structure of the Constitution would have been stronger if ?

I’ve been thinking about a structural “what if” in the Constitution, and I’m curious how others see it.

The Bill of Rights begins with the First Amendment — protections for speech, press, religion, assembly, and petition. Over time, that placement has given the First Amendment enormous symbolic and doctrinal weight. It’s the amendment most Americans can quote, and it has become the centerpiece of our civic identity.

But here’s the counterfactual I’m exploring:

One reason this question keeps pulling at me is that the First Amendment’s placement has shaped our entire civic imagination. Even though all rights are equal in theory, the first position gave speech a symbolic primacy that influenced doctrine, culture, and public reflexes. Meanwhile, the Constitution’s protection of life — though real — is scattered across several amendments and framed mostly in procedural terms. It makes me wonder how differently our legal culture might have evolved if the protection of life from unjust state action had been the first thing the Constitution taught us.

What if the first enumerated right had instead been an explicit protection of human life from unjust state action — with due process framed as the narrow, lawful exception?

In other words:

  • What if the Constitution had opened by saying, in effect, “The state may not take a person’s life except through full, fair, lawful process” — and only after establishing that boundary did it move on to speech, religion, etc.?

This isn’t about rewriting history or criticizing the framers.
It’s a structural thought experiment about ordering, emphasis, and constitutional development.

A few things make me wonder how different our legal culture might look:

1. Symbolic primacy matters more than we admit.

Even though all rights are equal in theory, the “First Amendment” has become mythic. Being first shaped:

  • civic imagination
  • legal scholarship
  • public reflexes
  • the sheer volume of doctrine built around it

If “protection of life from unjust state force” had been first, would that have become the cultural touchstone instead?

2. The protection of life is currently fragmented across several amendments.

Right now, the Constitution protects life through:

  • the Fifth Amendment (due process)
  • the Fourteenth Amendment (state‑level due process)
  • the Fourth Amendment (unreasonable seizures)
  • the Eighth Amendment (punishment limits)

These protections are real, but they’re scattered and mostly framed procedurally.
There is no single, explicit, front‑and‑center statement that the state’s lethal power is constitutionally bounded except through due process.

Would a more unified, explicit placement have changed how courts developed doctrine around state use of force?

3. Due process functions as more than a procedural step — it’s a boundary.

When you unpack it, due process isn’t just fairness in procedure.
It’s a constitutional retaining wall:

  • On one side: the state may not take life.
  • On the other: after full, lawful process, the state may impose certain penalties.

If that structural boundary had been the first thing the Constitution taught us, would our legal system have evolved with a clearer, stronger emphasis on preserving life in encounters with state authority?

4. This isn’t about modern politics — it’s about constitutional architecture.

I’m not arguing for a policy outcome.
I’m asking a structural question:

Would the Constitution’s overall design — and our legal culture — have been stronger if the protection of life from unjust state action had been the first enumerated right, rather than protections for speech?

I’m curious how others think this alternate ordering might have shaped:

  • doctrine
  • public consciousness
  • law enforcement standards
  • judicial interpretation
  • the balance between state power and individual security
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u/thevesaact — 1 day ago

What if Germany postponed Operation Barbarossa by a year to secure North Africa snd Middle East oil in WW2?

North Africa was always a secondary theater for Germany, with the Eastern Front receiving much more troops and resources that could have been used in North Africa. Even with limited resources, though, Rommel managed to make it all the way to El Alamein. Now imagine if he actually received considerable troops and supplies. Germany would definitely secure North Africa and Middle East oil during 1941 and perhaps part of 1942. what if they then launched Operation Barbarossa afterwards, in summer 1942, what would happen? Would they be better off than just attacking in 1941? They would have vast swathes of oil, and another front on the Russians, in the caucuses, where they could cripple Russian oil production and industry. They would probably also have more troops, tanks, planes, and experience to attack the Soviets with, but the Russians also would have produced more, including the (still threatening at the time) T34s and KV tanks, but with troops led by unexperienced and unqualified commanders, because of Stalins purge in the 30s.

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u/CauliflowerFlaky9903 — 3 days ago

If guns didn't exist, would warfare be too expensive?

Or would it have carried on like wars of the past, mostly on foot? If guns were never invented, tanks wouldn't be as effective or ground troops. What else would it effect?

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u/Head-Instruction-801 — 4 days ago

What if the Lebanese Phalanx (Kataeb Party), or and Other Christian Nationalist and phoenicianist factions had seized power in the Lebanese Civil War?

Would lebanese muslims and arab-indentified lebanese been cooked?

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u/Dismal-Ad8382 — 3 days ago

What if the Japanese 23rd Division successfully retreats at Khalkin Gol?

In our timeline: Zhukov arrives and conducts an enveloping maneuver that destroys the Japanese 23rd Division, 63% casualties. In an effort to prevent the incident from escalating, Tokyo promptly ordered the JAAF not to conduct any more air-strikes against Soviet airbases.

Point of Diversion: The commander of the 23rd division, with the help of air support, conducts a fighting retreat and a new defensive line is created, with no envelopment.

What would be the effects of this?

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u/BrianChing25 — 23 hours ago

What if the Vandals had stayed in Italy after sacking Rome in 455?

When the Vandals sacked Rome in 455, they didn’t just take gold—they took something far more symbolic: the imperial family itself.

The widow of Emperor Valentinian III, Licinia Eudoxia, and her two daughters, Eudocia and Placidia, were captured and taken to Carthage by the Vandal king Genseric.

One of the daughters, Eudocia, was married to Genseric’s son Huneric—a political alliance that strengthened Vandal influence.

What made this even more unusual was the religious divide: Huneric was an Arian Christian, while Eudocia was Catholic.

The other daughter, Placidia, was eventually returned to the Eastern Roman world.

As for the empress Licinia Eudoxia, she was also later able to return, though the details of her later life remain unclear.

Some sources suggest something even more controversial: that Licinia Eudoxia may have invited the Vandals to Rome in the first place.

Shortly before these events, Emperor Valentinian III had personally executed the powerful general Aetius—often called “the last true Roman.”

His death destabilized the Western Roman Empire and led to a chain of violent power struggles.

In that chaos, some believe the empress may have sought outside help—possibly as an act of survival, or even revenge.

But this raises an interesting question: what if the Vandals had not returned to Carthage after the sack of Rome?

What if they had stayed—and taken control of Italy itself?

Unlike the later Lombards, the Vandals were already a powerful naval force in North Africa.

Controlling both Carthage and Italy could have created a strong Mediterranean-centered kingdom.

However, their Arian Christian beliefs would likely have brought them into direct conflict with the Catholic population of Rome and the Papacy.

At the same time, such a move might have provoked an earlier and more aggressive response from the Eastern Roman Empire.

Instead of the fragmented Italy that would later emerge, we might have seen a Vandal-dominated Mediterranean power—one constantly balancing between internal religious tension and external pressure from Constantinople.

Or perhaps they would have collapsed even faster.

What do you think would have happened?

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u/quiethistoria — 5 days ago

What if the US had allowed the southern states to leave and form their own country (the Confederacy). Would the US be more unified today?

It looks for many presidential elections following the Civil War, the former Confederate states voted as a block. After the 20th century, ir seems like what is now called the “ blue states” expanded from that one voting block. So, if the southern states were a different country, would the remaining states be more unified than they are today?

For reference here is a link to maps of voting patterns. https://www.ranker.com/list/every-election-map-past-century-shows-dramatic-america-change/raelyn-giansanti

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u/Various-Try-1208 — 7 days ago

Could the Royal Navy alone have defeated the Japanese Navy, if there was no war in Europe?

In essence my question assumes that there's no war with Germany, but tensions between Japan and Britain build up in a similar way to the attack on Pearl Harbour. Only in this case there's no Germany or Italy in Europe and Britain can focus its full attention onto Japan but the USA is not it's military ally.

Since this is more a question of if Britain could have fulfilled the same role as the USA if it wasn't also fighting the Axis in Europe, we'd still assume that Japan is at war with China, so the war still starts of similar to our own timeline.

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u/Miniclift239 — 10 days ago

What if britain never kept the cape colony/ kept all Dutch colonies after the napoleonic wars?

This are two questions i know but you can answer just one or both if you want.

For some background, the cape colony was seized by the english during the napoleonic wars, gave back and retaken in 1860 where they did pay the Dutch so they could pay their debts.

Cape was a strategic location both to easliy supply india and to project naval supremacy so it makes sense why britain wanted It.

But what if they just didn't and the Netherlands kept it? How whould the scramble for africa go now? Whould the Netherlands take all of south africa here? Whould britain still want pieces of the region or whould they just dont care?

On the flipside what if the english kept ALL Dutch possesions: Indonesia,Suriname,ect. I know they didn't because they didn't want to get involved in the regional politics of those places but let's say they dont care here.

How much more stupidly powerfull whould britain be here with Indonesia as a colony? Whould the Netherlands start a war over this? Could they even control such a massive empire now?

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u/Odd-Total-6801 — 6 days ago

British Tiger Force could have changed outcome of WW2 in Japan?

I’ve been reading about Tiger Force (British bombers assigned for bombing Japan) and it feels like one of those things that almost happened but gets completely overlooked. By 1945 Britain was preparing to send a long-range bombing force to the Pacific, built around the Avro Lincoln, which was basically an upgraded Lancaster designed for longer range operations.

The plan was to operate out of places like Okinawa and join the bombing campaign against the Japanese home islands, but when you look at the timing it’s hard to see how much difference it really would’ve made. The B-29 was already in huge numbers and had been devastating cities with firebombing, Japan’s air defences were collapsing, and then the atomic bombs arrive not long after.

It kind of feels like Tiger Force would’ve just added more weight to something that was already overwhelming rather than changed the outcome itself.

That said, if you shift the scenario slightly and imagine the war dragging into 1946 without nuclear weapons, then it starts to feel a lot more relevant, because hundreds of Lincolns hitting Japan regularly alongside the Americans could’ve kept the pressure at a really high level and given Britain a much bigger role in the final phase of the war.

Curious what people think—was it basically too late to matter, or one of those things that only really becomes important in a longer war scenario?

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u/HistoricMultiverse — 7 days ago

What if Tassilo III had successfully resisted Charlemagne?

I’ve been reading about Tassilo III of Bavaria recently, and his situation made me think of an interesting “what if” scenario.

He wasn’t an open rebel against Charlemagne. Instead, he relied on alliances — especially through family ties and connections with the Lombards — to maintain a degree of independence.

In reality, things didn’t escalate into a major war. Instead, he was eventually brought to trial and removed from power.

But what if things had gone differently?

What if Tassilo had managed to strengthen his alliances enough to resist Frankish control?

Could Bavaria have remained an independent power in Central Europe?

And more broadly, would this have affected Charlemagne’s rise and the formation of his empire?

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u/quiethistoria — 6 days ago

What if the British conquered the entire Americas as opposed to the Spanish?

Imagine boarders are all the same but instead of Spanish influence, it was British like Canada, the US, Australia, and a couple Caribbean islands

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u/Maleficent-Toe1374 — 9 days ago

Order in the Court

Had the founders placed the highest priority on the protection of life from armed agents of the government after the Boston Massacre, would the ordering of the early amendments have taken a different shape, perhaps placing protection of life first, protected speech second, and the right to bear arms third?

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u/thevesaact — 8 days ago

If incendiary bombs were not used and only regular bombs were used to bomb Tokyo during WW2, then how much damage would the US Air Force have been inflicted?

Would this have been like the Blitz?

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u/K-jun1117 — 7 days ago

Chernobyl nuclear meltdown what if

what if The Chernobyl reactor melted down because something fell into it, like what else happened around that time that involved falling out of a plane or jumping

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u/Far_Equipment_5831 — 9 days ago