r/orthotropics

I discovered mewing over 8 years ago before it even went viral as a meme. And I'm still struggling with mewing (with the back 3rd of the tongue up) and breathing at the same time. Has anyone found an answer yet?

Hi everyone,

I got treatment with the ALF appliance plus a mandibularsplint for my tmj issues. I was wearing the devices for 6 months. While initially they made me feel amazing, that feeling was wearing off pretty quickly and my symptoms were creeping back. I saw my dentist a couple times and they made asjustments but it got worse and worse to a point that i had to stop the treatment.

Since then, i am just crashing and developed all kinds of dysautonomia symptoms. I have pain all over my body, constant panic attacs, extreme sensitivity to noise, light, dizziness and balance issues.

I did a CBCT scan and talked to another dentist, which said that the ALF only expanded one side of my cranium, leading to a severe cranial strain.

Anyone with similar experience? I am starting to loose hope as it has been 6 months since the treatment and i have not improved at all.

How I Still Have All Four Wisdom Teeth

A few years ago I watched nearly every friend I knew go through wisdom tooth extractions. The surgery, the recovery, the $1,200-$4,000+ cost. I went in for my own x-rays expecting the same conversation.

My dentist told me my wisdom teeth grew in straight. Enough room. No extraction needed.

In addition to feeling relieved I was curious. Why did I have room when almost nobody else did? It wasn't genetics. Both of my parents had theirs removed. So I started digging.

The Problem Is Hiding In Plain Sight

63-75% of people are born with all four wisdom teeth. That's not a genetic defect affecting a small population. That's the norm. Evolution doesn't mass-produce mistakes — we were meant to have wisdom teeth.

Our jaws aren't shrinking because of genetics. They're shrinking because they stopped being used the way they were designed to be used.

The data backs this up. Archaeological research on pre-agricultural skulls consistently shows wide, well-developed jaws with room for all 32 teeth. The wisdom tooth crowding epidemic is modern and diet-driven. As one oral surgery practice summarizes: wisdom teeth became largely useless as human ancestors evolved smaller jaws and adopted softer diets — a process accelerating over the last few hundred thousand years but dramatically worsening with industrialized food. (https://www.northcharlotteoralsurgery.com/blog/history-of-wisdom-teeth/). 

A 2011 study published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences found that early farmers who adopted softer cooked diets developed measurably shorter, narrower jaws than hunter-gatherers eating tough unprocessed food — within just a few generations. https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.1113050108

The jaw responds to mechanical load. Remove the load and the jaw stops developing fully.

The result for modern populations: smaller jaws, crowded teeth, restricted airways, and a generation paying thousands of dollars to remove teeth their mouths no longer have room for.

More research: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/11/111122112032.htm.

What Actually Made The Difference For Me

Growing up I ate foods that required real chewing. Dense meats, jerky, homemade bars with tough textures. This was never intentional. It was just how I ate.

Looking back and after viewing the research I believe that's the answer. Not luck. Not genetics. Consistent mechanical stimulation from chewing hard food throughout childhood and development.

The moment I made that connection I started giving the same chew-dense bars I grew up on to friends. Hard enough to actually work the jaw. The feedback was immediate — their jaws were sore.

Mastic gum works for most people and I respect it. But harder whole foods like meats are expensive, can violate some peoples' dietary restrictions, and don't let you practice liquifying food properly before proper swallowing. That's why I prefer homemade bars. Unlike gum you swallow them — which means you also practice proper swallowing technique and food liquification that Mike Mew emphasizes. Multiple orthotropic principles addressed simultaneously in one habit.

For comparison:

Falim gum — hard and cheap, but contains ingredients with questionable long term safety profiles. You spit it out, so no swallowing practice.

Mastic gum — better ingredient profile but expensive for daily use. Same issue — no swallowing practice.

Hard whole foods and dense homemade bars — real mechanical load, proper swallowing practice, no harmful ingredients, affordable enough to do every single day.

Whichever you choose — chew, chew, chew.

(Not promotional — if you want the recipe DM me. Didn't include it here because I didn't want to take away from the information in this post.)

Why This Matters Beyond Aesthetics

I know this community understands the deeper picture but it's worth stating plainly for anyone new here.

Braces cost $3,000-$10,000. Wisdom tooth extractions cost $1,200-$4,175. Orthodontic intervention is downstream of a development problem that begins with diet and chewing mechanics in childhood. You are paying to correct something that didn't need to happen.

Mewing addresses the resting posture side of the equation. Chewing addresses the active mechanical stimulation side. Both matter. Mike Mew has said as much — and if you look at the success stories in this community, almost every single one mentions a thorough chewing routine alongside tongue posture work.

Here's the thing worth sitting with: our ancestors weren't consciously holding their tongues to the roof of their mouths. Their oral posture developed naturally because their jaws were being mechanically loaded every single day through diet. The chewing came first. The posture followed.

If you're serious about orthotropics for yourself or your children, tongue posture and chewing need to be addressed together. One without the other is leaving results on the table.

The Practical Takeaway

At minimum — chew every meal thoroughly. Slow down. Liquify your food properly before swallowing.

Beyond that — actively introduce harder, denser foods into your diet. Tough meats, raw vegetables, dense homemade bars. Your jaw responds to mechanical load the same way any other muscle and bone structure does. Load it consistently and it responds. Remove the load entirely and it doesn't. If anyone wants the recipe for the bars I make at home, DM me. Happy to share.

Chew like your jaw depends on it. Because it does.

Please give me some advice

22 now, only recently became aware of how the shape of my face and mouth have affected me. In retrospect there’s a number of signs that something was wrong but I didn’t think it was my palate. I have sleep apnea because my tongue doesn’t rest on the roof of my mouth because the palate is too far back (not sure how to explain it better), so my tongue has always rested in the bottom/middle of my mouth, pushing on my teeth, and I have always had both an overjet and underjet that I’ve been in braces and aligners for to correct which they have. When I sleep my tongue always falls back and blocks off my breathing, which is why I use CPAP and sleep on my side. When I swallow, my tongue has always pushed against my front teeth. I always felt it was too big for my mouth.

I’m kind of just annoyed because I know there’s not really anything I can do at this age to correct this, I just don’t understand why as a child I didn’t place my tongue on the roof of my mouth properly thus allowing the palate to expand.