I hate how nowadays media made a lot of people seem to think that every awful person in media should be redeemed or get a pat on the wrist. (TL;DR at the end)
I don't mean a character changing for the better. Anyone CAN change, nothing is stopping them unless they're genuinely insane or damaged. It's always better for a bad person to become good rather than die or something. But that doesn't mean they're redeemed. They *changed*, and it's a huge difference people don't consider.
I don't even just mean forgiveness. It's equally (if not more) annoying when everyone just coddles and loves the mass genocide causer or the sexual assaulter just because they did a nice action. But no, I actually mean their *redemption*. But theres always the crowd of people who will HOUND you and jump down your throat to make you look dumb or downvote you, just because you think they shouldn't be made into "Oh redeemed pookie".
Take Valentino or Vox from Hazbin Hotel for example. A rapist, and a murderer/cultist/mass genocider. I see so many people arguing 'well they definitely can be redeemed, anyone can!'. In this show, Redemption means Heaven. People who literally used their human life to be awful, then continued being awful in Hell, PURELY for their own joy and benefits. Vox, in his craze of trying to kill someone, killed and took away other souls' rights to even *try* to be redeemed, and there's nothing to bring that back. Valentino literally has many souls stuck in contracts to be porn stars and strippers and prostitutes, and sexually abuses them directly. Oh, and he kills or beats you if you disobey, too. I'd be *pissed* if my pimp was being held on a pedestal and going into Heaven because he finally decided to be a normal human being, while I'm stuck with physical and emotional pain and scars for the rest of my life.
Or take Conquest and Anissa (or every damn viltrumite) in Invincible. Conquest is a crazed psychopath, and Anissa forces herself on Mark. Yet I constantly see people defending them and saying "But akshually, They have the capacity to be good, let them apologize and that's good" *No.* These were fully intelligent, capable beings who would gladly murder a lower race, and have little sense of boundaries and consent. I agree thats their lifestyle, its like a raised cultist changing their views, but their actions still need to be answered for.
And it's even crazier when their fans expect the characters to be forgiven. They literally say things like "Isn't forgiveness a virtue?" Justice is an equally important virtue. *Not letting a mass murderer go free or be part of the boys because he saved one life*. I feel like this mindset just encourages awful behaviors, and enables the view of "Oh, I can just change and everything will be okay? Well, let me just enjoy pulling all my shit until I suddenly feel too tired to, or I suddenly have regrets!". Jail in real life exists for a reason (Ignoring the fact it's useless in actual rehabilitating). In demonic/heaven based shows, Hell exists for a reason. In Hazbin Hotel, Hell isn't endless torment, it's literally just a bad town. So that "Endless punishment isnt okay for anyone" crap doesn't work here. The pimp running a succesful forced sex operation seems to be doing fine to me.
I think it just annoys me, because I see so many people go from "This murderer should be punished!" to "This literal spawn of the devil in terms of personality, is too hated! Arent they human too?!". *Especially* because 95% of the time, it's a hot character, which just gives the vibes of those real life serial killers with fangirls who want them let go. You will *not* see this same energy, at least often, for conventionally unattractive characters. So these people aren't arguing for actual good or justice, but to feed into their own egos and simping. "Fiction isn't reality, it doesn't reflect true opinions", Duh sherlock, but at this point that argument is void when Pokemon made people seriously argue for talking-animal beastiality, and people are starting to actually make arguments for tyrants *currently in our life.* And isn't it a known fact that media is responsible for so many 'awakenings'/realizations? Miss me with that. Anissa alone made people confuse their noncon fetish with her being forgivable. All of this is stuff I've seen with my own eyes, not even made up, and if you go searching in certain subs for even a few minutes you'll see the same. Give it some thought, and you'll realize morals *are* influenced by this sort of thing- or at the very least, expose a lot of pre-existing morals in people that are still problematically ignored. The internet went from joking about things like "If evil, why hot" to "Well, their victim's opinions don't matter to their redemption, so...Heaven!" (Pretty much an actual argument Ive seen)
It's just such a weird hill to die on too, that the hot assaulter shouldn't face extreme consequences. It's pretty much common consensus. Every cool or hot villain will have some group of defenders to grasp at straws to glaze them. Some of the arguments are valid, but being so aggressive against people who think otherwise, especially for your own agenda, is just hypocritical when way more problematic things are being ignored, but "Please spare this criminal" is top priority, with anyone who opposes being demolished. It's just such a weird idea to push, that everyone HAS to be redeemed and forgiven just because they can. Especially those who don't even want to, and actively continue their crimes no matter how much rehabilitation happens. At this point, Batman is as much of a criminal as Joker for letting that psycho live after 10 attempted arrests and moments of forgiveness.
TL;DR, I don't mind 'change'. But an awful person, fictional or not, shouldn't be given the credit of 'redemption' until that actual effort and retribution is shown and given. Something that should be the *default*, like an apology or becoming a better person, *doesn't* make them prime material for "The message of redemption!". It harms it, and downplays redemption and their actions. Especially when these actions have victims with irreplaceable losses. Justice is necessary too, and consequences do exist for a reason, we just cant get too out of hand, which I agree on. Eternal punishment or immediate execution isn't necessary for someone who's defeated and willing to change, but it's really just not right to let them walk free or to even forgive them so easily, especially in the place of the victims who *cant* forgive them even if they wanted. I don't know, I guess I'm seeing too much villain glaze and justifications and defenses, and when you get attacked with downvotes and arguments to even dare think a villain should lose a limb or something, it makes you question whether you went insane, or the internet. And this comes from a lover of *many* villains, but..can we please recognize and not downplay their actions?