Hope and Pleasure
Wanted to title this "good old school human" or something. Idk. Just want to ramble a bit if you want to walk with me, be my guest. I'm more asking a question, I think, of which I'm uncertain of the answer to, than making any grand theory or affirmations. Thus "experimental praxis".
I could give some backstory I guess, I quit my 70-80 hour a week job I've had since right after Covid this January 2026 and I've been coasting on my savings with no income/unemployment. So I've had time to think about my state of life and condition. Here's a link to my just-now reflection of GPT on my recent life. Not necessary for this post, just "backstory". Tldr is it's a simple diagnosis of "chop wood carry water".
But anyway. The point. I've always found Scrooge (iirc) a hard movie to watch. There's a saying in the bible of something like, just send them a spirit to save them and teach/save them/show them a better way, and he replies "they have Moses and the prophets and still [are like this]" or whatever. That's what Scrooge basically as a movie inverts/usurps. But a line I'm always thinking is "happiness is whatever you want it... 2B".
So. It's an old topic, the oldest maybe. What is hope. I've commented/posted about this frequently in the past, and think it's time for me to ask/post about it again. In short, we all know "the Helenes/Greeks and Philologists" already mapped out all the human psyche and condition ages ago. However I think there's a lot of gems of understanding we all miss even if we pick up on them. Praxis I guess is the word/flair.
I made a comment 8ish months ago that said it best;
>I'm saying like Gilgamesh and Enkidu. Civilized man and natural man. Natural man has "no rights". And is thus literally "freer" as not bound by any contractual obligations. However, when [natural] man is born they are imprinted with a birth certificate and the straw man legal fiction begins, the false alias persona, of "the Civilized man" - which we are not but a cog in a machine of "rights" which we did not consent or agree to. So "rights" technically are the antithesis of sovereignty.
This state specifically. I think the idea of "hope" is portrayed in Pandora's Box, as being, all the evils of the world. The box Zeus gave in punishment to man/Pandora (due to theft of fire iirc), contained "all the evils of the world". But when the box was opened; it only had; hope. In my prompt to GPT which generated the above reply, I noted that it is only fear and desire that keeps the "civilized" man on society/spectacle's treadmill. Natural man, lived freely in tune with nature; an "Enkidu" type. It is "hope" that is the (arguably, vain and delusional) chief motivator of compliance driving fears and desires and thus "participation in society" at scale. For reference on "scale", my comment today which re-initiated this train of thought (leading to this post). It's in-house (from this sub). But the short of it is the distinction of "society" between say natural tribes and communities versus our modern globalized system where local taxes go to overseas wars the home country has (practically) less than 10% support for. I've taken to calling this the "slush fund" society as opposed to more "natural man" society.
Anyway. Yes, I wonder often if this is what enlightenment means; what remains when all hope and/or desire/fears cease (GPT said enlightenment requires traction, not "stepping of the treadmill of Ecclesiastical vanity"). Natural Man? Pre-Pandora state? It's hard to describe. The place "devoid of hope" is the most profound state to me at least. Full realization that all is void in a wholesome way/manner. I'm curious if there is known praxis of this (is this the goal of "the quest"? The real meaning of "chop wood carry water"?).
Secondly there is Pleasure. Eden, means, simply; "pleasure". I think it's the same allegory as Pandora here. Everyone and their mom's dog says "Garden of Eden" but there was never any such thing. There was a garden, plated East of/Before - Eden. The Garden set BEFORE pleasure. The idea here eludes me I admit beyond parallel to Pandora's box. What does the "tree" represent? It clearly represents the knowledge that YHVH lied. He said if they would eat, they would surely/truly die. But they - did not die. The serpent "told the truth" while YHVH died. Though notably, YHVH - created - the serpent. So the same elusive (spiteful?) revenge/trickery theme/mechanism as Pandora's box.
So here the idea of "natural man" is seen as more innocent naivete recognizing guilt, than "hope" as a guiding/"civilizing" force. It's not to say Adam and Eve became hedonists, but is curious the Garden was set before pleasure, and they were expelled. Did they go East or West? If they went West, they would arrive in Eden/Pleasure presumably (I often wonder if this is referring to time, as in the Garden was chronologically BEFORE pleasure).
Either way we have two clear examples of "natural man" being "broken in" to the fiscal year and shaping the world into utilitarian/higher civilized constructs from on the one hand, Hope, and the other, Pleasure. Both equally tied with potential regret and shame (as well as some interpretations saying it has sexual connotations but that goes beyond scope of my post here save to say I like the phrase something like "one's sexual and social relations are reflections" - I'm lifelong voluntary celibate and essentially shut-in when not at work lol).
Anyway. I have always joked about "enlightenment" and desire to achieve it being like "hoping to cease hoping". You know what I mean? That tranquil void state where everything naturally clicks? Non duality, is that it? It feels more like "not one, not two" though. Non duality being a label or finger pointing, not this "tranquil/prince of peace" void vibe/praxis. Ofc I can't stay there is why I'm making this post, in reference to the feeling I briefly had tonight realizing I got turned down for a big job I hail marry'ed.
Idk sorry if this post is incoherent or doesn't belong here. Bonus points is curious though that Gilgamesh said there was fighting going on [in current world spectacle event] even in ancient times, in his day. And his day was considered ancient times to the early Greeks. Nothing new under the sun, this "vanity" is what I'm asking about perhaps. What is the point of hope and pleasure but to realize the "natural man" state beneath them? Is that/this what "beauty" is? Is it possible, natural man or civilized man, to be in alignment with a God that sent the civilizing force to man as punishment?