u/Ok_Egg852

I will preface this post by saying that I don't adopt labels. Gore Vidal once said that homosexuality doesn't exist, only homosexual acts do. Some view that as a cop-out, but I think he was right.

In any case, I wanted to discuss vegetarianism and veganism as they appear on Reddit. Not "vegetarians" and "vegans," but vegetarianism and veganism. Got it?

So, for quite a while I've been lurking, making the occasional comment on the vegan subreddits, which I usually take down quickly because I find that discussion there is impossible and that there are a few people who are convinced that they're right about everything, are "1% commenters" or whatever, and just about everyone else on the sub says they agree with them and falls in line. In other words, there really is no room for discussion, except for when the room all collapses into commiseration about how hard it is to be vegan, how misunderstood they ("we") are... and also how other people's opinions don't matter. Mark that. It's only the animals that matter. Well, okay. I kind of admire the spiritedness.

But it's kind of like a cult, isn't it? Scientology is a handy analogue here.

Now, I'm not saying that I believe that they're wrong. Animal suffering now is unprecedented in the history of the world, without a doubt. My mostly plant-based diet is a response to that, and also a response to the environmental degradation of animal agriculture, which is also unprecedented. I have, at times, adopted a completely plant-based diet myself.

As I've grown older I've decided that I have other things to think about and concern myself with. I won't elaborate them here, because that is between me and my personal conscience. I sometimes eat cheese and I sometimes eat eggs. I am aware of the issues and have decided on a personal compromise and am answerable only to myself. I take responsibility for my shortcomings. I'm not perfect, but I know that my personal choices have also saved the lives of countless animals, and have done so for decades... although I am also aware that this merely constitutes less animals being bred and slaughtered. I do believe that, for farm animals on farms as they exist today, it would be better for them never to have existed.

But here's my "beef," if you will, with the so-called vegan community. If you are really so self-assured and confident about what you claim to believe, then why are almost all of you so reluctant, why do you refuse, to engage in conversations with so-called vegetarians? Surely, if you're secure in your beliefs, a conversation poses no threat... yes?

And I know that so-called vegans will take exception to much of what I've said, because, as they say, "eating plant-based isn't veganism!" I'm sorry, but I disagree. It's the same thing, minus the identity politics.

Nietzsche said something that was wise and is much over-quoted, but useful in this instance: "When you fight monsters, be very careful that you don't become a monster yourself."

I can't escape the conclusion that the "vegan community," at least as it presents itself, has become somewhat monstrous.

I would like to see a little more personal introspection in the so-called vegan community and a little less, uh, herd-like behavior. The vegan community's insistance that "vegetarianism is worse than carnism, because you (the vegetarian) should know better" is a stupid, misguided and counterproductive ploy.

If you, as a "vegan," really were only concerned with animal welfare, you would learn to embrace your allies, some of whom may not be quite as "perfect" as you.

It's all about the animals, right? Not about your identity politics. Because what difference does it make if a person is "plant based" and doesn't identify as "vegan"?

In the final tally, none.

True believers are, historically, always the problem. If you don't believe me, read history. Or the newspaper!

Thank you for your kind indulgence.