u/KrispyKingTheProphet

I think everyone has been unpleasantly surprised by how much this season has been devoted to shilling Vought Rising instead of closing out the main series. It’s like they didn’t expect us to like Soldier Boy in season 3, but after realizing fans did like him a lot, they’ve turned to complete character damage control. There’s been so much focus on him this season and I originally thought there’s no way he’d not die this season, but now I really think he’s surviving the main series.

On top of that, I, like many fans, expected Homelander to be dead before the final episode and Butcher to become the main villain, but there is just not enough time left to pull that off. At the same time… they keep going back and forth on it. Like one episode Butcher’s panicking over his dog, nursing him back to health, and giving Hughie his word they’ll use V1 to save Annie and Kimiko and then the next, we’re being told he’s a homicidal borderline war criminal and they still continue to tell us that Butcher just likes doing shit like this, Homelander isn’t his reason for “Scorched Erf” it’s his excuse.

What if, and I really hope this isn’t the case but I’ve seen Kripke praise Better Call Saul when talking about prequels, they do something similar.

To those who haven’t seen Better Call Saul, it’s a Breaking Bad prequel that follows Saul, the lawyer, before the events of the series and explains how he became a corrupt lawyer, but also, you’d get a scene or two each season showing where Saul is currently, after the events of Breaking Bad. It hooks you by not completely being a prequel, you get a small subplot that’s a sequel to Breaking Bad, and as you get invested in the prequel story, you get more scenes from the sequel subplot until they converge and then at the end of Better Call Saul, you’re fully into a Breaking Bad sequel. It’s no longer a prequel but you’re fully following Saul post Breaking Bad as he faces the consequences of his actions from his past, the Better Call Saul and Breaking Bad past.

What if, and again, god I hope not, they are planning something similar. We get a Soldier Boy prequel but he’s still alive in the current time. The Boys ends with an unresolved cliff hanger of Butcher going full villain mode and then Vought Rising is a prequel truly, but follows the BCS formula where we do cut back to the main series timeline. Eventually leading to stopping Butcher with Soldier Boy playing a big part in it.

It’s stupid, but they’ve been trying so hard this season to make Soldier Boy seem more reasonable. They’ve done a poor job, like handing the keys to immortality to an absolutely lunatic because he, WW2 mascot, was in love with a Nazi? But they’re clearly trying and I don’t think they have enough time to continue and wrap up a story for him in one episode.

Idk, I hope it doesn’t happen, but I could see it now. The Boys has become kind of a parody of itself. They want to continue milking this franchise and once The Boys ends and the characters from this series are gone, interest is going to plummet. Already saw it with season 2 of Gen V and that was before the main series ended. I could unfortunately see that being their planned hook to get people watching Vought Rising. Leave things unresolved in The Boys, leave a cliffhanger like Butcher going mask off, then marketing Vought Rising as a show that’ll continue that storyline as well.

It’d be dumb as hell, but I can see it happening now.

This is not meant to be a condescending “well actually in the books” explanation like a lot of people do, just giving context for those who have better things to do than read all this books multiple times.

In the book continuity, Criston Cole is from House Cole, a small noble house who are sworn to the Dondarrion’s (Beric from the main series’ house.) The Dondarrion’s are a Stormlander noble house, but more importantly they are Marcher Lords. Marcher Houses are houses situated right around the Dorne and Stormlands border. At the point of the Dance, the Dornish are very much enemies of the crown. It’s not an open war, but there is no truce. This is why Reach houses and Stormland houses, Marcher Lords IN PARTICULAR, hate them so much. They attack the borders often.

Why is this crazy? Okay, I headcanon’d originally that Criston just had a Dornish mother in the show and favored her side, but I saw an inside the episode on YouTube where Condall flat out calls him a Dornishman. No other explanation. Alicent also says “he’s Dornish” and nothing is ever explained further. In the show continuity, apparently he is just Dornish.

Now, I’m neither Team Black or Green, both have awful people and I really checked out of the show mostly after season 2, but Criston in the books is still not a great guy at all, probably was motivated to some degree by the same incel response from Rhaenyra rejecting him (though it’s never confirmed,) but he is not like show Criston in how sniveling, pathetic, incel, toddler like throwing tantrums, and is a much better fighter in the books. Show Criston is just infuriatingly pathetic and it’s a shame they made his character what it is.

What’s insane though… Rhaenyra chooses a Dornishman as her personal guard and Otto is RIGHT THERE and doesn’t point out the fact that this is a Dornishmen: enemies of the crown and raid and kill people in his kingdom in particular. Rhaenys is half Stormlander, never says a word. Boremund Baratheon has Criston in his damn castle during the marriage tour and just doesn’t care when the Stormlanders absolutely despise Dornishman… this man is the personal and sole bodyguard to the heir too!

It would be like if the US president hired one of the top military personnel from the Soviet Union or Castro’s administration to have full autonomy to guard their child themselves, except it’s not even a Cold War with Dorne at this point. They actively attack the kingdoms, they killed a dragon and one of Aegon’s wives, they’ve captured and killed countless nobility from the kingdoms, among many other things. This isn’t like Ned hiding Syrio, who’s exotic and from a place outside of the Seven Kingdoms because Bravos and the Seven Kingdoms have a healthy relationship and do a lot of trade with each other and use the Iron Bank for crown finances. Dorne is the damn enemy at this point in time.

The show canonically has him as 26 years old. Jensen Ackles looks fantastic, especially for 48 (probably 46-47 during filming of season 5) but he does not look 26. I understand from a meta standpoint you can’t have an actual immortal playing the role, but now that we’ve seen the rest of the cast, they actually could pass for around that age.

Do we Soldier Boy’s backstory is going to be different than standard young guy in his 20s enlisting in some military experiment? Maybe he’s actually a full on fuck up in his 30s when the war rolls around and he enlists. I feel like we’re going to get a less confident and much more insecure Soldier Boy in Vought Rising. Maybe part of that comes from enlisting later in life. Maybe the rest of the cast are regular, young drafted soldiers. Soldier Boy’s a rich, nepo man-baby who skips the actual soldiering but gets into the trials anyway. Maybe that’s why everyone seems to dislike him from those days on top of just being some rich kid. Maybe he was legitimately too old and untested to qualify by normal means, gets it anyway, and becomes the strongest. I’d hate that guy too. Not that this is that big a deal anyway.

Dalton Greyjoy is not a good person… but he is kind of cool in the Dance. Daemon advising Rhaenyra to not make him declare, but just give him leave to indulge his bloodlust on the Lannisters next door is great, and the Lannisters losing is always fun. He’s a fun side character, despite being a dickhead.

What makes this confusing and disappointing is when you think about how desperate HotD seems to be to milk the source material for as many seasons as possible. Season 2 entirely felt like them spinning their wheels. With proper pacing, the entire war should be 3 seasons max, including the Hour of the Wolf. Yet season 1 ended with the war beginning and then season 2 ended… with the war beginning? If you want the show to continue for more seasons, stop axing side characters. Why is Nettles cut? Why cut Dalton Greyjoy? Hell, why cut the CGI dragon Cannibal? Not even a real character but Cannibal is interesting enough and you could devote an entire episode to just the dragons. The theories and Fire & Blood hints that Cannibal is a different type of dragon to Valyrian dragons are compelling.

It’s just weird. They took 1/4 of a single book and decided to turn it into a long running series, yet they’re still cutting material? The math ain’t mathing.

I don’t think the manga ever answers this. So I guess it’s just a question of what your opinion is, but do you think Gojo made a Binding Vow with Unlimited Void to where touching someone protects them from the sure-hit?

I think the benefit and the trade off could simply just be the same thing. If Gojo wants to protect people he’s brought into his domain, he can touch them and prevent the sure-hit. At the same time, if someone wants to avoid the sure-hit >!like we see Sukuna do!< they have an option to. It’s a strength and weakness at once and it makes sense. Gojo can’t seem to select targets in UV and he doesn’t want to fry friend’s brains.

With how the series went, it becomes very easy to look at the books with nothing but purely rose tinted glasses. And yes, the books are generally incredibly well written and a better way to experience the story in almost every way, imo (minus the odd great change or inclusion: like Arya being at Harrenhal with Tywin or Tywin “counseling” Joffrey on the throne. Though I do like how Roose is more of a character in the books, whereas in the show, Ramsay’s popularity in the fandom seemed to diminish Roose’s importance. Tywin’s interactions with Arya were just better. The scene with Tywin and Joffrey on the throne was a very interesting inclusion too. It’s maybe the only time we see Joffrey in a disagreement but actually in the right. Fans tend to way over-hype Tywin because Charles Dance is an acting force of nature, but that’s scene is nice because, though it seems to have gone over a lot of heads, it does show Tywin’s pride giving him blinders and that he does have a habit of short sighted-ness.)

Anyway, I’m doing a reread and I’m close to done and for the first time during a reread, I’ve acknowledged that while they are some of my favorite books of all time and are exceptionally well written… they’re not perfect.

I’ll give my example first: the whole situation with Ramsay/Reek and his introduction is very… goofy and so needlessly complex. Even by ASOIAF standards, original Reek and Ramsay’s backstory is just vile and not in a well written, chilling way like Euron Greyjoy. It feels more like George was just trying to be as gross and vile as possible with no real motive or reason other than to establish these two people are awful. Like Ramsay is a bastard that wasn’t even acknowledged by Roose until 297 when he brought him to the Dreadfort. Though Roose gave Ramsay’s mother Reek as a joke to help raise him. He spends a bizarre amount of time describing Reek’s stench and presenting him as basically having magical, blood magic BO? Why am I getting also this information on original Reek smelling so vile that he would bath thrice a day and even stole all the perfumes from Roose’s wife Bethany, and nothing worked? Why is this important enough to bring up maybe more than twice? Why does Roose even suffer this servant’s presence in general? He’s just a servant AND we know he’s not just a necrophiliac, but he’s known for being one. Roose’s whole motto is “a peaceful land, a quiet people.” He himself is a monster, but he’s extremely discreet and understands the importance of restraint. There’s no world where Roose Bolton keeps a disgusting, useless, necrophiliac in his household. It goes against his character. Necrophilia is a serious crime and Roose is allowing it and harboring a practitioner of it, this is likely right after or around the time when Ned cracked down on the Bolton’s and formally outlawed flaying in the North too. Roose would not add un-needed risk and attention to himself for zero possible reward.

Then there’s the actual story… Ramsay and Reek grew up inseparable, came back to the Dreadfort when he became the unofficial heir, and both were known for their horrifying “hunts” by this point. In case you need a pleasant refresher, here’s one: Ramsay and Reek would kidnap girls, take them out into the woods, free them, hunt them down, Ramsay would rape them, Ramsay would kill them, then Reek would rape the victim’s corpse. This was something they regularly would do too and it was not a secret: Ramsay and Reek had a vile reputation and exploits were known before Roose brought Ramsay to the Dreadfort. We know this from multiple other sources, but when Lady Donella Hornwood comes to Winterfell for the Harvest Feast, she mentions Ramsay is amassing men at the Dreadfort and mentions the tales of Ramsay and Reek, like this is just common knowledge in the North. Ramsay is the son of a Great Lord, but also a bastard. He’s the perfect mix of famous enough for these kind of things to be known in the North but not legitimate and a bastard of THE problem house in the North who Ned kept an extra close eye on in particular, as Robb later mentions (I.E. there’s no world where Ned didn’t know about Ramsay and Reek and kidnap, torture, rape, necrophilia: all offenses that’d earn you an execution with Ice. There were also witnesses/survivors. This is interestingly and bizarrely stated.) Roose brings Ramsay to the Dreadfort as an unofficial heir over a year before Robert even arrives at Winterfell. Ned knows Ramsay is guilty, what he’s guilty of, where he is, and his only protection is his father who is already on thin ICE (hah) with Ned. There’s no logical way Ramsay wouldn’t have been already arrested and executed.

Then it somehow gets worse, more silly, and more disgusting, more nonsensical too.

Ramsay kidnaps Donella Hornwood and forces her to marry him (also bizarrely written because given the fact that Ramsay is later rode down by Rodrik and I think it’s like a dozen men maximum Rodrik has. Was Lady Donella just riding alone with no guard? Because it’s also implied just Ramsay and Reek kidnap her.

Anyway, as we all know, he murders her by forcing her to starve, he usurps the castle, it lasts all of 15 seconds before Ramsay is labeled a criminally to be caught and executed. So knowing all of this, Ramsay and Reek are still going on “hunting” trips when Rodrik and his posey come across them after Ramsay has raped and killed the poor girl. The details and timeline and details are so fucking weird here because apparently Ramsay’s horse is already lame and can’t be ridden. He noticed Rodrik’s posey, yet he still has time to pull Reek off the corpse of the girl he is actively raping while this is happening. They make a plan to swap clothes and all identifiers of Ramsay’s identity, put Reek on the horse that’s able to ride, Reek rides off looking like Ramsay. Ramsay, and the text legitimately describes this, notices the dead girl completely soiled herself during the act. So he smears himself in piss and shit, dons Reek’s clothes, and just hangs around there. “Ramsay” is killed and “Reek” survives, which is also pure nonsense. Ramsay is accused of forcing Lady Donella to marry him, which is guilty of and it’s legally… odd, but Ramsay is by law, a lord currently. I supposed just killing him would be a real possibility and no one would blame Rodrik, but even if he just gets executed without a trial, that’s not how executions work under Stark law. He’d be captured and his head would taken after saying his last words. This wasn’t a battle or heat of the moment. “Ramsay” was just shot dead with arrows because it’s the only way this Scooby Doo ass plan doesn’t immediately unravel. AND THEN, “Reek,” the co-mass murdering rapist, necrophiliac, who was stated to have participated in Lady Donella’s abduction and that whole plot… he gets jail time? It’s all nonsensical and so unnecessary. You could’ve done the entire Theon taking Winterfell plot line except just make Reek the actual Reek. You could’ve introduced Ramsay through stories from real Reek and still have him show up at the end same way. It would’ve been better and wayyy less convoluted.

Come to think on it, book Ramsay is just a badly written character. People loved him in the show, but in the books, he just kind of sucks, is boring, and pretty one dimensional. He doesn’t have any real characterization or uniqueness to him like other monsters in the series. He’s just the worst person possible and not much more.

Anyway, way too much rambling. I just never really sat back and thought about how dumb the whole Ramsay/Reek thing was until rereading this time.

What’re your choices?