I keep reading that there should be a thumbs width between your toe and the end of the boot.
If you bought a pair that had a 1/4” gap between the leather insole and the end of the toebox, would you feel that everyday, and would that bother you greatly?
Hi!
Im looking at boots that have the uppers (both at vamp and around heel) flared out and stitched directly to the midsole.
I noticed that some boots do a kind of 270 stitching to the midsole, then, AFTER putting the outsole on, stitch the outsole midsole, and insole, directly to the flared out vamp.
That seems a lot more complicated than just doing a 360 stitch around the midsole, so i was wondering, during a resole,
would it be possible to just sow the rest of the vamp to the midsole and glue the outsole on?
I’ve noticed a lot of bootmakers are flaring out the uppers to stitch to the midsole directly, rather than using any kind of welt.
Obviously that construction has water resistant qualities to it, but I noticed that most heritage boots are 270 goodyear, with a clinched heel stack.
For whatever reason, that just really makes me feel weird, like the boot is “exposed” in some way, though that may all be in my head - but I’m learning that it’s not entirely wrong, as many 270 owners speak of avoiding wetness in that area.
Nails are also stronger than glue, but add weight!
360 goodyear seems to combine them all?
But it is still a goodyear welt, and the upper is still tucked in rather than flared out.
This method seems to be used a lot by the higher end line of a lot of mainstream boot brands.
Seems to strike a great balance, but heel stack and/or whole outsole is still clinched on.
The most confusing to me, is JK’s design, where the midsole is re-stitched 270 at the back, then AFTER the outsole is on, its stitched the rest of the way in the front, but still goodyear welted around the whole thing?
Seems cool, but not a good time for the cobbler, who may or may not rebuild them in the same way, and would charge a lot if they did maybe?
Nicks 360 stitchdown seems the most awesome.
Almost a blake stitchy thing going on, but the only models they offer that on are the newer ones with 8IR rubber instead of leather for both mid and insole. Or the Nd3, which has hybrid leather/rubber layers. which is custom lead time only, and starts off around $700.
What do you guys prefer?
Pros? Cons?
Which is cheapest to re-sole at the cobbler?
Which is the best overall?
How do you guys measure width?
A lot of boot companies ask you to use tailors measuring tape to take a ball circumference measurement.
The problem is, there can be vastly different measurements depending on how you measure!
Standing up (most width)
Sitting down (how shoemakers do it?)
How snug should the tape be?
Kinda firm,
Real snug (really bring the end of the tape over)
etc.
Hi!
Local redwing store has my size iron rangers in stock, and i’m seriously thinking about them.
Two things that concern me though….
The vibram mini-lug seems great, but are they as grippy as sneakers in most situations?
I heard that you can get them replaced with any vibram sole however, such as a unit lug.
The footbed is cork filled, .
Its not unlikely that if these are your daily drivers, you might get caught in a downpour and have to walk a couple miles, and maybe be forced to step through light puddles.
For anyone that has gotten their iron rangers wet enough to feel wet socks, have they dried out ok?
Did the cork permanently deform, leaving you with an uneven or lumpy footbed?
Also, these shoes lack a true midsole.
Can you run/jump lightly in these at least somewhat similarly to sneakers, or are they so hard that you would only recommend normal walking?
Thanks!
I am seriously considering a pair of Nicks (6-8”) or potentially the tanker.
How does it feel to wear boots everyday?
Does anyone here who does that ever “miss” sneakers?
Are your boots extremely heavy and cumbersome in most situations, or do you get used to it?
Do you have to open them up and let your feet breathe often?
If you wore one pair of 8” boots with a softer midsole, every single day of your life, would you be happy?
Buying them would be the type of investment for me that would mean that I wear them everyday as a lifestyle choice.
I don’t want to think about having 6 pairs of shoes for each individual use case anymore, and having 1-2 pairs for everything, for years, sounds better!
I don’t work a laborious job, but I am very hard on my shoes, and adventure often.
What are the pros and cons of daily driving them?
A tanker style seems to fit me best, but I’m afraid of their performance on long, serious walks.
A traditional 8” laceup sounds great, but potentiallu overkill for most of life!
I am seriously considering a pair of Nicks (6-8”) or potentially the tanker.
How does it feel to wear boots everyday?
Does anyone here who does that ever “miss” sneakers?
Are your boots extremely heavy and cumbersome in most situations, or do you get used to it?
Do you have to open them up and let your feet breathe often?
If you wore one pair of 8” boots with a softer midsole, every single day of your life, would you be happy?
Buying them would be the type of investment for me that would mean that I wear them everyday as a lifestyle choice.
I don’t want to think about having 6 pairs of shoes for each individual use case anymore, and having 1-2 pairs for everything, for years, sounds better!
I don’t work a laborious job, but I am very hard on my shoes, and adventure often.
What are the pros and cons of daily driving them?
A tanker style seems to fit me best, but I’m afraid of their performance on long, serious walks.
A traditional 8” laceup sounds great, but potentiallu overkill for most of life!
Hello!
I was hoping maybe this community would have some answers to, or perhaps create a discussion on, lasting boards and water!
Many shoes and boots use cellulose based lasting boards, as some part of the lasting layer, with a composition similar (or equal) to this:
UNIFLEX Shoe Sole Material 2.0 mm
Composition:
Cellulose fibers: 70–84%
SBR adhesive (styrene-butadiene rubber): 10–20%
Water: 5–10%
Additives and dyes: less than 1%
Some have veg-tan leather on top of that board, or full veg-tan leather.
My concern is water!
Let’s say I need to cross a slightly tall puddle, or get stuck walking for miles in a downpour, and water gets into my shoe, and I need to dry them.
Can a higher quality lasting board like that survive a wet/dry cycle without permanent deformation?
Can a full leather lasting board survive without deformation?
If the fiberboard portion is above the outsole, and below a veg-tan layer, which is then blake stitched to the upper, is it very difficult to get water in there?
I have had many shoes (and maybe some boots!) de-construct themselves after improper care after performing activities which allowed the inside of my shoe to get wet, but I believe that many of those shoes/boots were of very low quality, with perhaps just cardboard as a lasting layer.
What is your boot/shoe buying strategy for “might get wet”?
I know that full wetness, all of the time, warrants an entirely different shoe/boot, but what about the occasional and incidental soak?
Waterproof or “water permeable” boots are very specialized, and usually not “daily driver” friendly.
Hello!
I was hoping maybe this community would have some answers to, or perhaps create a discussion on, lasting boards and water!
Many shoes and boots use cellulose based lasting boards, as some part of the lasting layer, with a composition similar (or equal) to this:
UNIFLEX Shoe Sole Material 2.0 mm
Composition:
Cellulose fibers: 70–84%
SBR adhesive (styrene-butadiene rubber): 10–20%
Water: 5–10%
Additives and dyes: less than 1%
Some have veg-tan leather on top of that board, or full veg-tan leather.
My concern is water!
Let’s say I need to cross a slightly tall puddle, or get stuck walking for miles in a downpour, and water gets into my shoe, and I need to dry them.
Can a higher quality lasting board like that survive a wet/dry cycle without permanent deformation?
Can a full leather lasting board survive without deformation?
If the fiberboard portion is above the outsole, and below a veg-tan layer, which is then blake stitched to the upper, is it very difficult to get water in there?
I have had many shoes (and maybe some boots!) de-construct themselves after improper care after performing activities which allowed the inside of my shoe to get wet, but I believe that many of those shoes/boots were of very low quality, with perhaps just cardboard as a lasting layer.
What is your boot/shoe buying strategy for “might get wet”?
I know that full wetness, all of the time, warrants an entirely different shoe/boot, but what about the occasional and incidental soak?
Waterproof or “water permeable” boots are very specialized, and usually not “daily driver” friendly.
Just got an update from Goral that all their shoes, including the SMUGs, have a full leather lasting board above the outsole and the felt filling.
Maybe the Rose Anvil video cutting them in half and showing the fiberboard was for a previous iterations.
This post, originally, was about the concern of fiberboard getting wet (accidentally step in deep puddle), walking in rain for extended time, etc.
I’ve had shoes fall apart on me in varying circumstances, and I personally noticed that vulcanized soles, heavy use of adhesives, and very cheap fiberboard tends to make shoes susceptible to “de-constructing” themselves - much to my chagrin.
However, I’m probably referring mostly to the lower-end of build quality of truly disposable shoes, with very cheap cardboard/paper layers.
I’m pretty convinced that these shoes do indeed have fiberboard, as i’ve found out that most sneakers (regardless of quality) do.
The quality of fiberboard varies, where as this kind:
https://www.leather.lt/en/genuine-leather/product/718/uniflex-2-0-mm-shoe-sole-material/83/
Is a higher quality kind with content:
UNIFLEX Shoe Sole Material 2.0 mm
High-quality UNIFLEX sole material made from a cellulose-based compound. Designed for professional shoemaking, footwear repair, and the production of durable, high-performance shoes.
** **
Composition:
* Cellulose fibers: 70–84%
* SBR adhesive (styrene-butadiene rubber): 10–20%
* Water: 5–10%
* Additives and dyes: less than 1%
Might not be the exact kind used, but something named “uniflex” can be seen in the lasting and blake stitch part of this video (making of the smugs):
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9hldhjOCkPo&pp=ygUTR29yYWwgaG93IGl0cyBidWlsdA%3D%3D
It is indeed stitched into the shoe.
Apparently, even the highest end sneakers, and nearly all sneaker style shoes (regardless of price) have some kind of fiberboard lasting layer for light weight and structural integrity.
It probably has something to do with shoemaking that i’m unfamiliar with.
To get a full leather lasting board, it seems like very heavy boots have them by default, and its generally reserved for the most expensive and/or extreme use-cases, or its a functional heritage feature in some dress shoes.
A higher quality fiber lasting board will indeed last a very long time, and potentially survive a soak with care were you to step into a puddle.
I wouldn’t want a full leather lasting board to get soaked either, but my main fear is permanent deformation and/or de-construction after serious and accidental or incidental wetting, which it seems like a high rubber content would help avoid.
A situation that would require a full rebuild.
Seeing as how goral offers that, its not the worst thing to know!
But it starts pushing this shoe, for me, into more of a luxury rather than functional item, and removes some of the ruggedness for me.
Finding a cobbler locally, that has the same last, with the same blake stitching capabilities, will probably be very difficult and/or very expensive.
One of the main appeals of smugs, to me, is the fact that I can have one pair of sneakers that I can take anywhere and do anything with, that are very boot-like (without being a boot).
With the occasional mishap adding to the patina rather than ruining them.
I don’t want to wear full on PNW boots everyday, and I think that hiking that involves crossing streams would warrant a whole different shoe, but i do want a shoe to fill basically every other gap.
Smugs are so gorgeous and fill such a nice niche, but I will need to do a bit more research.