▲ 114 r/DeadlockTheGame
Hot take: Dynamo ult should…
Make the knockdown applied to him trigger immediately, because the gravitational force will accelerate that anvil as well.
u/Hyacinth_s — 5 days ago
u/Hyacinth_s
▲ 53 r/DeadlockTheGame
Just made a post about Rem and apparently someone claimed I do not know how to math, so here is a thread that records some in-game data gathering, formulas, as well as healing computation.
1: how is Rem T3 spirit power boost calculated?
In the ability description, T3 gives Rem 35 raw spirit power increase, as well as a 15% spirit power increase.
The explicit formula should be given as follows:
>sp_new=(sp_base+35)*1.15.
Here sp_base is the value you read directly from the hero description.
In particular this means it stacks multiplicatively with boundless spirit.
We can prove this claim by observing the following: at 78 base spirit power, at T3 tag along, we get the following reading:
and it matches the formula ((38+30)*1.15+35)*1.15=130.18.
>Note here in game it shows 132. My guess is that Deadlock likes to round up numbers at each stage of the computation. So the exact reason why you get 132 is the following: you get 38 base spirit power, then boosted by the boundless spirit's 30 raw spirit power, as well as 15%. This gives you (38+30)*1.15=113.19999999... Then deadlock rounds up this value to 114, then the tag along buff jumps in, and give you (114+35)*1.15=131.1, then gets round up again to 132.
However, for the purpose of our computation, I think its safe to use the formula I proposed at the start, which is sp_new=(sp_base+35)*1.15, since plus or minus 1 hardly affects the late game.
Another fun side note: if you have echo shard, then the buff from tag along actually stacks, as you can see in the following screenshot.
Here I entered tag along while in well-rested, thus my spirit power buffed to 191.
The formula here is still given by sp_new=(sp_base+35)*1.15, where sp_base is your spirit power before entering tag along. Thus, in the previous screenshot, we had 132 spirit power, and at second tag along, you get (132+35)*1.15=191 spirit power.
The overall formula for echo shard tag along then gives you the following spirit power formula:
>sp_new=((sp_base+35)*1.15+35)*1.15=1.3225 sp_base+86.5375
In the above, sp_base would be your spirit power before using two tag along in consecutive.
2: how is Rem tag along interact with healing boost
This one is very easy: it adds another 1.25 multiplier at the very end of the computation. It can be reflected directly in ability description, unlike the spirit power buff from T3 tag along.
As we can see here, its 17.3%+62/s before the healing booster, and it jumps to 21%+75/s after:
Based on those two observations, we can finally compute the healing per second of Rem's tag along.
3: Math is mathing
Let us test Rem's healing potential in the following build, at level 0.
Note this value changes as you level up, because Rem gets a 1.1 spirit power per level.
During tag along, this is Rem's stats:
Note in the top right, it shows 163/sec as healing, this is because Rem got a base regen of 20 from this build. Thus, the correct healing per second he does in this state should be 153. It matches the formula:
>(211*0.44+28)*1.25=151.25
In the above, 211 is his spirit power, that 1.25 at the outer most is from healing tempo, and 28 is the base stat of the ability, and 0.44 is the scaling.
Therefore, we can conclude Rem's healing per second against a single target is calculated by the following formula:
>sp_new=(sp_base+35)*1.15
m=missing health
hps=(((0.15+sp_new*0.0003)*m+(sp_new*0.44+28))*1.25)/24
After expanding and using float numbers, we arrive at the following final value, based on the raw spirit power:
>hps=0.00001796875*m*sp_base + 0.00844140625*m + 0.0263541666666667*sp_base + 2.38072916666667
Note I did not compute the burst healing of the second tag along, and that value will be significantly higher because two consecutive tag along stack the spirit power buff. But that math is also harder, so let us put it aside for now.
4: Let us put this into perspective
Now let us compare this healing with other heroes in game.
First we have Kelvin.
This one is very straight forward to compute. The healing per second is given by
>hps=(90+1.7*sp_base)*1.25/4.9
Now, in our testing build, the sp_base=160(he has 150 base spirit power, and rapid charge gives a bonus 10 spirit power to charged abilities), thus the overall healing per second is 92.8571428571.
Thus, if we want to make Rem's tag along as effective as frost grenade, we need to solve m for the following equation:
>sp_base=150
0.00001796875*m*sp_base + 0.00844140625*m + 0.0263541666666667*sp_base + 2.38072916666667=92.8571428571
=> 0.0111367187500000*m + 6.33385416666667=92.8571428571
=> m=7769.19042607891
Hence, we conclude, in order for Rem's tag along to heal as effective as a single target ability, compare to Kelvin's nade, you need to have 7769 missing health.
By the way do you know Kelvin's nade is an AoE and can throw them while sitting at the back?
Meanwhile tag along can lead to Rem themselves getting killed, if your teammate dives.
5: Echo Shard?
Left as an exercise.
u/Hyacinth_s — 7 days ago
▲ 25 r/DeadlockTheGame
He has one of the lowest win rate in all heroes. Also, as rank goes up, his win rate drops instead of increases. He is the only hero in eternus + games that fall below 45% win rate. Those are very strong indications that this hero really need some kind of tweak or rework or simply adjusting the values so its a viable option again.
What I feel about Rem is that he gets punished way more than other support type heroes from poor positioning of your teammates.
For example, playing as Paige, regardless of how your teammate's poor positioning, you always just stay back and give shields and throw books etc.
Similar for Kelvin, he does not get killed or punished by other teammate's decision or bad play.
Rem is the only one that will be forced to dive into the enemy if the teammate he tags decide to dive.
There are countless other cases where I just cannot heal the teammate that need to be healed because the current teammate I'm tagging decides to hide in the corner and do nothing, or gets killed because the teammate I'm trying to save did not back up but instead keep diving.
Its really frustrating to play that way, getting severally punished by my own teammate's bad play, while I'm just trying to do my job.
On the other hand, I feel Rem's healing is way too weak, compare to other heroes like Paige and Kelvin.
A simple computation shows in order for Rem's T3 tag along to be as effective as Kelvin's grenade, as a single target ability, the teammate need to have 1500 to 2000 missing health.
>errata: check this post for healing per second comparison with Kelvin
https://www.reddit.com/r/DeadlockTheGame/comments/1t6qgmk/some_research_on_rem_as_well_as_healing_per/
If I'm trying to heal a squashy M1 carry, its almost impossible to match Kelvin (it would mean the M1 is missing 90% of their health). The buffs I get from T2 and T3 is hardly justifiable, because Kelvin can literally just heal the entire team every 7 seconds while also kill every single enemy using his ice beam.
Now, not only his tag along gets severally punished by bad teammates, his little helper also becomes more or less useless if the enemy team knows basic macro. I think its one of the reason why he drops win rate the more you know the game.
Overall I just dont think Rem's kit is working right now, as the only situation he can utilize his kit and have a better winning chance is that your teammates knows how to coordinate while your enemies has no clue how to clean sinners and control lanes. But in that case I think you can play any other hero and still win the game.
This nature has made Rem a very bad character overall, and it would be really nice if we can change that and make Rem better reflects the player's skill, instead of the teammates skill and enemy skills.
Also, his ult also becomes more and more useless the higher your rank is.
Counterspell can easily block a 175 second ult, which is really ridiculous in my opinion. Not to mention we also got indomitable now, that also deletes this ult.
Compare to other supports, Pagie's ult can be counterspelled (but much harder, due to the speed of the ult), and is affected by the indomitable, but it also heals the teammates along the way, and it gives a stun, which is very nice.
Kelvin's ult is one of the best in the game if played correctly, and gives a massive heal and dispel, and you cannot counter it in any meaningful way.
This also feels extremely unfair.
Here are some little suggestions that I think might solve some of the issues:
1: Make his tag along passing through walls, so that Rem can still gets away if my teammate decides to dive into their fountain or 1v6 without backups. Also, it would be really nice if Rem can parry when he jumps out of the ally, because at the current stage, when Rem jumps out of an ally, he cannot use parry until he lands on the ground. Feels it would be really cool if he can jump out early and help teammates to parry.
After those two QoL improvement, I got two ideas:
- maybe change the item range/durtion bonus into an overall range/durtion bonus, or
- at T3, besides the spirit power bonus, also make the missing health brust into an overall maximum health brust
2: Make his pillow T3 more meaningful... adding 90 base damage without improve the spirit power scaling is just way too silly and feels lazy to me.
My ideas are one of the the following:
- remove that 90 damage increase and increase the cooldown on pillow hit, or
- make it improve the spirit power scaling, or
- applies a mini stun of 0.5 seconds or something, if it hits an enemy thats been affected by Rem's ult
3: Make his little helper more useful in team fights, because at the current stage, if the enemy knows how to handle lanes, this ability is basically useless, in the sense that the movement speed and spirit resistence does not get buffed by the spirit power increase of tag along T3. Feels like a very bad synergy between abilities. Here are some ideas:
- at T3, make the spirit resistence scale with spirit power, or
- also buff the teammate heroes with a maximum health increase at T3, that scale with either Rem's spirit power, or level, or vitality invesments, so that tag along's missing health brust is stronger, and it distinguishes between Pagie's shield or Kelvin's massive healing.
4: Make Rem's ult more impactful, by either implementing the T3 pillow mini stun, or something like the following:
T1: takes reduced damage while channling, and apply a undispellable slow if stay in the gaze for too long
T2: stay the same
T3: make all enemies slowly walk towards rem at certain speed (that can be countered by moving in the opposite direction), and has reduced CD (but with values reduced)
- Even more interesting would be that Rem can control the enemies walking direction, by giving them sweet dreams or nightmares (by pressing ult again during channling). So if its blue gaze the enemy in the gaze will walk towards Rem, and if its yellow gaze the enemy in the gaze will walk away from Rem.
This way his ult's sleep can still be cancelled by counterspell or indomitable, but it still has some level of impact.
Anyhow, I guess that's all I'm about to rant today, thanks for reading it.
u/Hyacinth_s — 7 days ago