u/ConcentrateIll9460

As many are probably aware, sorcerers have existed for three editions now and in the first two there were plenty of sorcerer-only spells.

But in 5e, they got rid of them. This seems silly, all other classes have spells unique to them - why not sorcerers? Wizards used to prepare each spell they'd use each day, but now they cast the same way sorcerers do, so the entire reason the sorcerer class was invented (to be an alternative that could cast on the fly) is gone now.

Surely then it's even more important that they have their own spells! Aside from just giving back some of their old ones, what kinds of spells would you give sorcerers?

Got sick of the lack of simple options - yes, we're missing a warrior with anywhere near as many choices as a wizard. But we're also missing a mage that's as simple to build and play as a barbarian!

So, say I was trying to make the champion version of a magic user - something for a player who wants to be throwing fire but doesn't want the complexity of spellcasting. My thinking was give them access to one broad, simple trick per subclass - one has telekinesis, another makes things go boom, etc. And baseline class feature is just a moderate range, simple magical attack. So we're going talking a mage with the low versatility of a warrior, meaning it should be doing roughly the same damage.

1d10 every two levels?

The various discussions where people suggest classes D&D used to have (like warlords and swordmages) that covered ground 5e doesnt like has me curious. And I don't mean stuff like ninjas which could fit in 5e, but are pointless since you could just make them as a subclass.

What class that used to exist would fit the worst in 5e? We've heard about the stuff that is missing, so I'm curious as to what is best left behind ^1.

^1 I don't necessarily mean best left behind because bad idea, can just mean doesn't fit with 5e's design.

So, created new homebrew martial classes for my players and it's worked great, given a couple of them a playstyle they really vibe with. Gave the classes a stamina system (stronger moves cost tempo, weaker moves build it), added a bunch of aoe and bleeds and blinds and chokeholds etc, lots of lassoing dragons and spinning/throwing them by the tail Mario and Bowser style.

Lots of control, utility etc has to come at a price though, and for balance that price is single target damage! In terms of unconditional damage, each does about half the sustained single target a fighter does. I'm intending to keep it that way, but there's room to push the envelope: conditional damage, ensure that doing more damage is a meaningful choice rather than an obvious pick.

So far I've had a few that have been successful - you'll notice they all share a theme of having high potential effect, but of there not being an obviously correct choice:

• Blood Frenzy, go berserk and attack the nearest creature, friend or foe, unable to stop until you or a target you've attacked dies.
• Through the Self, stab sword through yourself and opponent for massive damage to both.
• False Finish, ignore a nearby bloodied target to lunge at an unbloodied one.
• Throat Cut, bleed for thirty damage each round and weakened while bleeding (one example of a ton of damage over time ones, bleeding can be fixed by being healed for more than you're bleeding for or you or an ally taking an action to staunch)
• Wrecking Ball, multi-turn maneuver where the user charges at least 15' and attacks a target as long as they haven't moved beforehand. The party needing to set up there being a viable target each round has proved a fun combat puzzle, since your last target is probably right next to you and can't be charged.

So! Now that I've exhaustively explained the exact context (sorry people last thread who found it unclear!), does anyone have any other ideas for making single target damage itself something with meaningful choice?

So, created new homebrew martial classes for my players and it's worked great, given a couple of them a playstyle they really vibe with. Gave the classes a stamina system (stronger moves cost tempo, weaker moves build it), added a bunch of aoe and bleeds and blinds and chokeholds etc, lots of lassoing dragons and spinning/throwing them by the tail Mario and Bowser style.

Lots of control, utility etc has to come at a price though, and for balance that price is single target damage! In terms of unconditional damage, each does about half the sustained single target a fighter does. I'm intending to keep it that way, but there's room to push the envelope: conditional damage, ensure that doing more damage is a meaningful choice rather than an obvious pick.

So far I've had a few that have been successful - you'll notice they all share a theme of having high potential effect, but of there not being an obviously correct choice:

• Blood Frenzy, go berserk and attack the nearest creature, friend or foe, unable to stop until you or a target you've attacked dies.
• Through the Self, stab sword through yourself and opponent for massive damage to both.
• False Finish, ignore a nearby bloodied target to lunge at an unbloodied one.
• Throat Cut, bleed for thirty damage each round and weakened while bleeding (one example of a ton of damage over time ones, bleeding can be fixed by being healed for more than you're bleeding for or you or an ally taking an action to staunch)
• Wrecking Ball, multi-turn maneuver where the user charges at least 15' and attacks a target as long as they haven't moved beforehand. The party needing to set up there being a viable target each round has proved a fun combat puzzle, since your last target is probably right next to you and can't be charged.

So! Now that I've exhaustively explained the exact context (sorry people last thread who found it unclear!), does anyone have any other ideas for making single target damage itself something with meaningful choice?

Other than it being part of a resource based subsystem, anyway. People often get confused by this kind of question and say stuff like "add conditions like prone!" which makes what you're doing more interesting, but doesn't actually answer what I'm asking - which is specifically single target damage itself and what variations can make it more interesting.

So - what mechanical ideas do you guys have for adding more meaningful choices to make for dealing single target damage? I've given players access to several abilities, and would appreciate ideas for more. So far I've used:

• Deal more damage to unbloodied enemy if near bloodied enemy (typically efficient to focus down wounded enemies, genuine friction in choice)

• Similarly, deal extra damage to targets they haven't damaged yet. (Requires movement and otherwise inefficient splitting of attacks - though both this one and the last don't work in single enemy fights)

• Stab sword through self, attack deals massive extra damage to both you and target (this one's obvious, HP cost)

• Enter frenzy that deals more damage each turn, frenzy ends when you kill one of the targets you've attacked, have to spend each turn charging and attacking nearest creature (enemy team tries to have you start closer to an ally so you attack them instead, ally team tries the reverse)

• Dealing damage over time, less upfront in exchange for continuous damage over the fight (this isn't a video game, fights don't last for minutes, turns it into a meaningful tradeoff)

• Having a character change to a stance that starts weaker and gets stronger over time, but is positional in requirements or interruptible (have to stay where you are, ended once a certain amount of damage is taken, have to move at least 20' each turn)

• Honourable mention to stuff like "add a mark or whatever on a hit, consume X marks for Y effect" which is just a resource system but attached to a specific for instead

Other than it being part of a resource based subsystem, anyway. People often get confused by this kind of question and say stuff like "add conditions like prone!" which makes what you're doing more interesting, but doesn't actually answer what I'm asking - which is specifically single target damage itself and what variations can make it more interesting.

So - what ideas do you guys have for adding more meaningful choices to make for dealing single target damage? I've given players access to several abilities, and would appreciate ideas for more. So far I've used:

• Deal more damage to unbloodied enemy if near bloodied enemy (typically efficient to focus down wounded enemies, genuine friction in choice)

• Similarly, deal extra damage to targets they haven't damaged yet. (Requires movement and otherwise inefficient splitting of attacks - though both this one and the last don't work in single enemy fights)

• Stab sword through self, attack deals massive extra damage to both you and target (this one's obvious, HP cost)

• Enter frenzy that deals more damage each turn, frenzy ends when you kill one of the targets you've attacked, have to spend each turn charging and attacking nearest creature (enemy team tries to have you start closer to an ally so you attack them instead, ally team tries the reverse)

• Dealing damage over time, less upfront in exchange for continuous damage over the fight (this isn't a video game, fights don't last for minutes, turns it into a meaningful tradeoff)

• Having a character change to a stance that starts weaker and gets stronger over time, but is positional in requirements or interruptible (have to stay where you are, ended once a certain amount of damage is taken, have to move at least 20' each turn)

• Honourable mention to stuff like "add a mark or whatever on a hit, consume X marks for Y effect" which is just a resource system but attached to a specific for instead