u/Chrysippus_Ass

I am a member some facebook groups, but I don't find the public groups to be ideal. What additional spaces are there that I might not have heard of?

Some thoughts on emotional detachment and Stoicism. Don't take this as giving the whole picture, it's just the way I've come to understand it and I'm happy to discuss, elaborate or to be corrected.

On a first look it may seem that Stoicism promotes:

1. The suppressing of emotions
2. Emotional detachment from other people and not caring about them
3. That a perfectly wise person will not experience emotions

Now, if these really are true then I think it's perfectly understandable that someone would be a bit cautious of studying Stoicism. From fear of becoming too emotionally numb and detached - "I wouldn't want to be too Stoic" as it were.

But as I see it, points 1 & 2 are wrong. While point 3 is partially correct but needs to be qualified a lot.

One particular passage that may seem to support points 1 & 2 is this one:

> When faced with anything you find attractive, useful, or lovable, remember to tell yourself what kind of thing it is. Start with the least important things. If it’s a jug you like, say, ‘I like a jug,’ because then you won’t be upset if it gets broken. If you kiss a child of yours or your wife, tell yourself that you’re kissing a human being, because then you won’t be upset if they die.

Epictetus Enchiridion 3 (Waterfield, Robin, p. 53)

Taken on it's own, it sounds like Epictetus is simply instructing us not to be upset if our children or spouses die. Or even to view and treat them the same way we would a jug. But this passage is easier to understand when we read the whole of Discourses 3.24, where it is probably taken from. Similar words are used in this Discourse:

> Moreover, at the very time that you’re taking pleasure in something, present yourself with the opposite impressions. Can there be any harm in murmuring in an undertone as you kiss your child, ‘Tomorrow you will die’? And the same goes for your friend: ‘Tomorrow you’ll leave the country, or I will, and we won’t see each other again.

Epictetus Discourses 3.24.88 (Waterfield, Robin, p. 277)

However the context of this discourse is about a man who is afraid to leave his home and perform his duties in case his family members die while he's away. Epictetus explains that death is an inevitable fact of the world. It's not that he shouldn't care about his family, bur rather that he should not let fear of death prevent him from fulfilling the roles he has undertaken.

And there is much more from Epictetus on fellow-feeling and family affection, for example

> I shouldn’t be as unfeeling as a statue, but should maintain my natural and acquired relationships toward gods, father, brothers, children, and fellow citizens

Epictetus Discourses 3.2 (Waterfield, Robin, p. 217)

A similar idea is found in the Discourse 1.11, where a father leaves his sick child behind because he's afraid she won't get better and he can't bear the sight of her. This is not a behavior that Epictetus approve of. From those and others, I can't really see much that support points 1 & 2 as they are.

For the Stoics, the goal was to develop into an excellent person so that you can live the best possible life. This means understanding the world and your place in it correctly. And a part of that relates to the emotions one will experience. But what emotions would be left in a person who manages to do that? I don't think spite, envy or a desire to harm others. But certainly love and affection. But that is going into point 3 which I'll leave for now.

But it is a completely different thing from trying to suppress emotions or being callous.