u/Aromatic_Response_73

If "good" does not meaningfully relate to intuitively desirable states such as love, joy, peace, freedom, flourishing, or well-being, then what does the word "good" actually mean?

Because if "good" simply means "whatever aligns with God's nature," then saying "God is good" becomes circular rather than informative.

With that in mind, consider that free will does not require access to every conceivable outcome in order to be meaningful, and can be meaningful as genuine choice within a fully flourishing context (in this sense: love, joy, peace, freedom, and well-being).

For more context (in the case the discussion deviates from what the first paragraph says) I would recommend reading this other post (this is so I dont have to constantly copy paste from it as a response):
https://www.reddit.com/r/Christianity/comments/1t0o8xp/giving_ultimateness_to_misalignment_with_life/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

If "good" does not meaningfully relate to intuitively desirable states such as love, joy, peace, freedom, flourishing, or well-being, then what does the word "good" actually mean?

Because if "good" simply means "whatever aligns with God's nature," then saying "God is good" becomes circular rather than informative.

With that in mind, consider that free will does not require access to every conceivable outcome in order to be meaningful, and can be meaningful as genuine choice within a fully flourishing context (in this sense: love, joy, peace, freedom, and well-being).

For more context (in the case the discussion deviates from what the first paragraph says) I would recommend reading this other post (this is so I dont have to constantly copy paste from it as a response):
https://www.reddit.com/r/Christianity/comments/1t0o8xp/giving_ultimateness_to_misalignment_with_life/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

By real and unreal, I mean what is experienced as more or less fundamental within consciousness.

If heaven is that which aligns most fully with the soul's natural, meaningful state, crudely expressed as Love, Joy, Peace, Freedom and Creativity, then it should reflect something fundamental about reality itself rather than a conditional or optional state. It would follow that this alignment is not just one possible outcome among others, but the deepest expression of what reality is.

My argument is that our souls were created in accordance with LJPFC. But while that is true, we experience a non native, heavily constrained state of being in the earth system. The earth system is where these qualities do not always feel intrinsic. We come here to learn to express and thereby evolve our true nature within a context of constraint within our consciousness, biology, etc.

God isn't indifferent to what his creation ends up choosing, I believe you would agree with that as well, but magnify that by a trillion billion considering how UNconditional his love is. Therefore it is pretty safe to assume that ALL will be healed and that ALL will be accepted no matter what.

You can hold credence for the term "good" as long as its meaning is conflated with something like Love, Joy, Peace, Freedom and Creativity. Here they work together as (crudely put) the of the meaning of life. There is alignment and misalignment with that, and the idea of eternal separation implies ultimate misalignment. It is apparent within experience that things like LJPFC are experienced as less form based conscious experiences than, for example, religious ideas of goodness, and are felt as more real and less arbitrary. Because of this, they appear as a more real possible driver or principle for creation.

Importantly, LJPFC are not meant merely as moral actions one can simply choose to do or not. Rather, they point toward qualities of conscious experience itself when it is undistorted, its baseline intrinsic texture when not constrained.

There is alignment and misalignment with this, but misalignment is not an equally fundamental alternative. It is better understood as distortion, constraint, or limitation within consciousness.

If that is the case, then the idea of eternal separation or eternal misalignment becomes difficult to justify as a coherent feature of reality. It would imply that a distorted or constrained mode of being can exist as an ultimate stable endpoint rather than something contingent and resolvable. This suggests arbitrariness in the structure of reality, where what is less fundamental can nonetheless become final.

Therefore, the possibility of eternal separation from heaven would imply an unreal and arbitrary reality design. But this does not mean that a lower reality such as the temporary earth experience could not in some way serve that ultimate reality.

Free will can be understood as a movement of consciousness operating within these systems, not as the ability to actualize anything whatsoever. Free will can serve a purpose like adding novelty to reality, but the existence of choice does not justify the possibility of eternal self defeating states. To claim that, while considering everything we cannot choose, we can somehow choose eternal separation from life implies that reality is arbitrary in its design.

All reality systems operate within divine law and the choices available for you are far vaster in heaven, but not arbitrary (neither are they on earth). The foundation of reality itself is of qualities aligned with LJPFC since they are, crudely put, the meaning of life. It is important not to stick too tightly to terms, since that would limit reality, but they serve as pointers.

We do have free will and are not coerced to do anything, yet all souls are of qualities aligned with LJPFC, and these qualities work together in unison.

In that sense, choosing distortion as a temperament can happen, but it is a locally learned pattern from the earth system and does not apply to higher reality. Distortion, or misalignment with the divine self, arises within constrained systems, but it is not something that can remain stable indefinitely. It is eventually always resolved.

By real and unreal, I mean what is experienced as more or less fundamental within consciousness.

If heaven is that which aligns most fully with the soul's natural, meaningful state, crudely expressed as Love, Joy, Peace, Freedom and Creativity, then it should reflect something fundamental about reality itself rather than a conditional or optional state. It would follow that this alignment is not just one possible outcome among others, but the deepest expression of what reality is.

My argument is that our souls were created in accordance with LJPFC. But while that is true, we experience a non native, heavily constrained state of being in the earth system. The earth system is where these qualities do not always feel intrinsic. We come here to learn to express and thereby evolve our true nature within a context of constraint within our consciousness, biology, etc.

God isn't indifferent to what his creation ends up choosing, I believe you would agree with that as well, but magnify that by a trillion billion considering how UNconditional his love is. Therefore it is pretty safe to assume that ALL will be healed​ and that ALL will be accepted no matter what.

You can hold credence for the term "good" as long as its meaning is conflated with something like Love, Joy, Peace, Freedom and Creativity. Here they work together as (crudely put) the of the meaning of life. There is alignment and misalignment with that, and the idea of eternal separation implies ultimate misalignment. It is apparent within experience that things like LJPFC are experienced as less form based conscious experiences than, for example, religious ideas of goodness, and are felt as more real and less arbitrary. Because of this, they appear as a more real possible driver or principle for creation.

Importantly, LJPFC are not meant merely as moral actions one can simply choose to do or not. Rather, they point toward qualities of conscious experience itself when it is undistorted, its baseline intrinsic texture when not constrained.

There is alignment and misalignment with this, but misalignment is not an equally fundamental alternative. It is better understood as distortion, constraint, or limitation within consciousness.

If that is the case, then the idea of eternal separation or eternal misalignment becomes difficult to justify as a coherent feature of reality. It would imply that a distorted or constrained mode of being can exist as an ultimate stable endpoint rather than something contingent and resolvable. This suggests arbitrariness in the structure of reality, where what is less fundamental can nonetheless become final.

Therefore, the possibility of eternal separation from heaven would imply an unreal and arbitrary reality design. But this does not mean that a lower reality such as the temporary earth experience could not in some way serve that ultimate reality.

Free will can be understood as a movement of consciousness operating within these systems, not as the ability to actualize anything whatsoever. Free will can serve a purpose like adding novelty to reality, but the existence of choice does not justify the possibility of eternal self defeating states. To claim that, while considering everything we cannot choose, we can somehow choose eternal separation from life implies that reality is arbitrary in its design.

All reality systems operate within divine law and the choices available for you are far vaster in heaven, but not arbitrary (neither are they on earth). The foundation of reality itself is of qualities aligned with LJPFC since they are, crudely put, the meaning of life. It is important not to stick too tightly to terms, since that would limit reality, but they serve as pointers.

We do have free will and are not coerced to do anything, yet all souls are of qualities aligned with LJPFC, and these qualities work together in unison.

In that sense, choosing distortion as a temperament can happen, but it is a locally learned pattern from the earth system and does not apply to higher reality. Distortion, or misalignment with the divine self, arises within constrained systems, but it is not something that can remain stable indefinitely. It is eventually always resolved.

(By real and unreal, I mean what is experienced as more or less real within consciousness.)

If heaven is that which aligns the most with the souls natural meaningful state, crudely expressed as Love, Joy, Peace, Freedom and Creativity, then it should be the ultimate reality for everything within creation without conditions.

You can hold credence for the term "good" or as long as it's meaning is conflated with other terms like [Love, Joy, Peace, Freedom and Creativity], here they work together as the meaning of life. There is alignment and misalignment with that, and the idea of eternal separation implies ultimate misalignment. It is apparent within experience that things like [LJPFC] are experienced as less form (idea) based conscious experiences, than eg. religious ideas of goodness, and are felt as more real and less arbitrary, and therefore felt as a more real possible driver or principle for creation.

Therefore the possibility of eternal separation from heaven would imply an unreal and arbitrary reality design. But this does not mean that a lower reality such as the temporary earth experience couldn't in some way serve that ultimate reality.

Free will can serve a purpose like adding novelty to reality, but to claim that (while considering everything we cant choose) somehow choosing eternal separation from life is possible, implies that reality is arbitrary in its design.

My argument is that our souls were created in accordance with [LJPFC]. But while that is true, we experience a non-native (heavily constrained) state of being in the earth system.

The earth system is where Love, Joy, Peace, Freedom and Creativity don't always feel intrinsic, we come here to learn to express and thereby evolve our true nature within a context of non-native constraints within our consciousness, biology etc.

We do have free will and aren't coerced to do anything, but all souls are of qualities aligned with [LJPFC] and the qualities work together in unison. All reality systems operate within a range of choices available to you, and that range is far vaster in heaven, but not arbitrary. The foundation of reality itself is of those qualities since they are crudely put the meaning of life. It is important not to stick to terms too tightly since then we are limiting reality, but I'm giving some pointers.

Evil is not a part of the rule-set in heaven. Yet your soul is not coerced to do anything, and is the you that feels like you to you, but even far more you may sense on earth.

Consider that choosing distortion as a temperament happens, but it is a locally learned idea from the earth system, and does not apply to higher reality. Distortion (misalignment with the divine self) is eventually always resolved.

(By real and unreal, I mean what is experienced as more or less real within consciousness.)

If heaven is that which aligns the most with the souls natural meaningful state, crudely expressed as Love, Joy, Peace, Freedom and Creativity, then it should be the ultimate reality for everything within creation without conditions.

You can hold credence for the term "good" or as long as it's meaning is conflated with other terms like [Love, Joy, Peace, Freedom and Creativity], here they ​work together as the meaning of life. There is alignment and misalignment with that​, and the idea of eternal separation implies ultimate misalignment. It is apparent within experience that things like [LJPFC] are experienced as less form (idea) based conscious experiences, than eg. religious ideas of goodness, and are felt as more real and less arbitrary, and therefore felt as a ​more real possible driver or principle for creation.

Therefore the possibility of eternal separation from heaven would imply an unreal and arbitrary reality design. But this does not mean that a lower reality such as the temporary earth experience couldn't in some way serve that ultimate reality.

Free will can serve a purpose like adding novelty to reality, but to claim that (while considering everything we cant choose) somehow choosing eternal separation from life is possible, implies that reality is arbitrary in its design.

My argument is that our souls were created in accordance with [LJPFC]. But while that is true, we experience a non-native (heavily constrained) state of being in the earth system.

The earth system is where Love, Joy, Peace, Freedom and Creativity don't always feel intrinsic, we come here to learn to express and thereby evolve our true nature within a context of non-native constraints within our consciousness, biology etc.

We do have free will and aren't coerced to do anything, but all souls are of qualities aligned with [LJPFC] and the qualities work together in unison. All reality systems operate within a range of choices available to you, and that range is far vaster in heaven, but not arbitrary. The foundation of reality itself is of those qualities since they are crudely put the meaning of life. It is important not to stick to terms too tightly since then we are limiting reality, but I'm giving some pointers.

Evil is not a part of the rule-set in heaven. Yet your soul is not coerced to do anything, and is the you that feels like you to you, but even far more you may sense on earth.

Consider that choosing distortion as a temperament happens, but it is a locally learned idea from the earth system, and does not apply to higher reality. Distortion (misalignment with the divine self) is eventually always resolved.